170 Model Differences.

[Skeletool]

I've been researching 170's for a little while now, and I think it may be a great fit for my next airplane. My last airplane was a '47 Cessna 140, which I sold 8 Years ago. I took 7 years off from flying, and am now in a flying club with a 1938 Piper J3. While the Cub is a wonderful little airplane, I would like to be able to go on trips with my wife and kids. So a 170 is sounding pretty good.
I have a few questions which I haven't been able to answer by searching on the web.

First off, from what I can tell, the origional 170 had fabric wings (like my 140 did), V shaped struts, 140 style verticle stab, rounded wingtips, and I assume flaps just like the 140.
Did it have dihedral? I know the 170A didn't.
Due to the fabric wings, was it any lighter?
Is the fuselage the same as the A and B?
Are there any benefits to the 170 over the A and B? Any detractions?

Does the absence of dihedral in the A model make a noticeable flying difference?

How well do 170's handle crosswinds, compared to say a Cessna 140?
How is Pattern Visiability?
Do all 170's have a BOTH fuel selector position?
And finally, is there any reason the 170 can't be slipped?

Sorry for the avalanche of questions
Thanks

[3958v]

I will try to answer your questions, having owned the 48 170 and my dad owned a 140. The wings on the 48 170 were built using the 140 air foil. The ailerons are the same. Fuel tanks are from the same stamping press only the caps are from a 195. There were originally 3 of the 12.5 gallon tanks but about half of the 48s have been modified for 4 tanks and a total of 50 gallons of fuel. My 48 has a small bit of dihedral. All 170s have nice flying caracteristics and are quite capable in a significant crosswind in the hands of a capable pilot. All 170s have some of the best forward visability available in a taildragger. Probably one of the biggest problems with a 48 comes if you want a larger engine as there are no STCs for a larger engine. The A&B have STCs for 180 hp Lycomings. 48s and A models generally sell for a little less than the B models. That said I like many was looking for a B when I came across a nice 48 and have been flying it for 18 years. I have no desire to trade up as the condition of the plane you purchase is much more important than the model you purchase. Bottom line if you liked the 140 you will probably love a 170. Just 2 more cylinders to feed and take care of but it makes a good traveling airplane if speed is not real important to you. Bill K

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

Did it have dihedral? I know the 170A didn't.

Yes the 48 and the B model have dihedral. The A model does not. Most folks can't tell the difference.

Due to the fabric wings, was it any lighter?

'48 170s tend to be lighter than other models not because they have fabric wings but they tend not to be loaded with avionics extras.

Is the fuselage the same as the A and B?

Yes for all practical purposes as far as room inside. But as the years progressed there are minor changes for example the B model has nut plates in the carry through spar making shoulder harness installation easy. And of course the rag wing attaches differently.

Are there any benefits to the 170 over the A and B? Any detractions?

Benefits:'48s tend to be cheaper.
Detractions: Some people don't want fabric. No STC for larger engines but this effects very few people.

Does the absence of dihedral in the A model make a noticeable flying difference?

No.

How well do 170's handle crosswinds, compared to say a Cessna 140?

Crosswind capability will be limited to the pilots skill, not the aircraft.

How is Pattern Visiability?

As good as any other high wing aircraft

Do all 170's have a BOTH fuel selector position?

I think so. The A and B models do.

And finally, is there any reason the 170 can't be slipped?
You can slip a '48 and an A model regardless of flap position. A B model can be slipped safely without full flaps deployed but with the flaps there is no reason to slip the B model except for fun.

Sorry for the avalanche of questions
Thanks

We will forgive you this time.

[jrenwick]

If you live in a cold climate, one important difference is the cabin heaters. The later "B" models keep you nice and warm; earlier models are a little lacking. The differences are 3" vs. 2" SCAT tubing, and some added ductwork in the cabin of the later models (maybe '54 and later -- I'm not sure) that route warm air to the back seat on both sides. Early models just have a heat outlet on the firewall, I believe. That and hinged vs. slotted flaps seem to be the most important differences across the model line.

[GAHorn]

Due to the likelihood of subsequent equipment changes, this is probably irrelevant,....(it's most likely a matter of individual airframe these days).....but bare airframe-to-bare airframe.....the 170 was approx 10 lbs heavier than later models due to internal wing structure such as compression struts and crosswires.

[Skeletool]

Thanks for help guys, that makes things much easier.

[Brad Brady]

If you have found a 170 cheep......(I prefer a B model, just cuz I have more time in them.) Buy it. the market is soft right now, but is getting better, as I see it.The 170 line, straight, A or B, are as good aircraft as the 140 you used to fly. Each have there own nuances, but none are unfamiliar to your understanding of a 140.