The International Cessna^® 170 Association

I know many of us have seen and/or heard of people flying overloaded aircraft, but Saturday I had the unfortunate opportunity to see it first hand.

At about 10:45 am Saturday morning a C-172 with four adults (mid-30's) and at least two golf bags on board departed Mansfield, MA. The aircraft stalled and crashed beore reaching the end of the runway killing two and leaving the other two in critical condition. The pilot radio'd a mayday saying he did not think he would clear the trees, tried to turn back to the airport, stalled and spun in.

http://www.boston.com/news/local/articl ... ane_crash/

http://www.bostonherald.com/news/region ... id=1030455

While it's possible that the investigators may find engine trouble as a contributing factor, what I saw and what is being reported indicate the cause is likely an overloaded (weight/CG) aircraft and insufficient airspeed leading to a stall/spin.

Folks, I know we are all reasonable people here. I don't mean to sound preachy... but let's always keep aircraft and personal limits at the forefront, so that we, our children, and our planes all have long happy lives.

Last weekend was the first time I've ever had four people in the 170 and I did a weight and balance three times before I even got to the airplane. I then briefed my co-pilot that if we were not in the air at 2000 feet (3000 feet remaining) we would abort and reevalaute what was going on. the point being I did the research, had a plan, briefed the plan, and executed the plan. I also double and triple checked that everything was within llimits, both mine and the aircrafts.

Sad/discouraging to see pilots making improper decisions.

v/r,
Jud

What the heck is going on with these dummies.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLkW6ktt6V8

Now a bonanner pilut cain't be tole much but come on - (pilot)shortened field, tail wind, high d/a, high med-day temps, overloaded and rising terrain at the departure end of the runway. 2 fatal!

I e-mailed Miles another one a few days ago about the overloaded Glasaire at Kern County. Family of six perished. A dad and one of his sons perish in Lake Michigan.

People - do we need to shoot surviving pilots for ever taking any-one with them to their deaths? June through September there have been more gen/av fatalities than is acceptable.

Its interesting to read that you checked your wt. & balance 3 times when you had four people in your plane (before you took off) Jud. I did the same thing the only time I have had 4 adults in my plane. I unwittingly made my passengers a little nervous with the amount of time I spent figuring - but I told them I was just being cautious. DA was only 2k +- and I didn't have full fuel. The old girl flew just fine.

FWIW, the DA at Mansfield was 2300 +/-. Don't know the fuel load. He took off on rwy 32 (3500' paved) with his flaps deployed at what looked like 20 deg. His speed over the ground was extremely slow... like 50 kts.

It seems that there is a disconnect between what you can theoretically teach a pilot, and what he needs to learn for himself. It depends on the personality I guess.

Some of these guys just can't take the engineers and CFIs' word for it and have to learn the hard way. It's sad that people die because of it.

To some, performance limitations are unproven myth until they stuff it in the trees.

The first thing that struck me (other than an overloaded/aft CG airplane) was that the pilot, in the middle of trying to keep an airplane barely under control on the ragged edge of a stall, took time out to radio a Mayday! That's the last thing that would have entered my mind under those circumstances. Fly the airplane first - worry about declaring an emergency later!

As I age, I'm sounding more like Richard Collins from Flying magazine...Russ Farris

Exactly, Fly the plane , not the mic. It's hard to believe that in this situation the first thing that someone would do is grab the mic. Totally unbeleivable.

Joe

There is an amazing tendency these days to subconsciously believe that a call for help might save you. In the sims I teach, I frequently see pilots interrupt emergency procedures to report their emergency. It always surprises me when they do that. (Another "modern development" I also disagree with but must comply with is the policies which teach a pilot "what does the light mean? and what can I do about it?....versus intimately knowing the aircraft's systems. In the "good ol' days...an applicant would be required to sketch the fuel system and it's components, hydraulic system, pneumatics, electrical system, etc etc ...as part of the oral exam to determine the applicant's knowlege. These days only two light-weight questions are asked of each system and the oral is virtually over. Result: large vacancies in many pilots understanding of their aircraft, and an overbearing dependancy upon checklists... checklists are no longer guidelines to assist in completeness of actions...they are now step-by-step instruction books. It takes 15 minutes these days to flip a switch off and back on to reset a tripped alternator! Can't begin the takeoff roll until 6 speeds are posted in the FMS and crosschecked, the aircraft weight, top-of-climb, and detailed routings are programmed and don't forget to enter/verify the holding pattern at the final approach fix at the other end of the flight.

If I had an engine failure on takeoff, I'm pretty sure one of the things I would do is announce over the CTAF what was happening.

First of course, push. Find a spot to land or crash, go for a restart, whatever your engine failure on takeoff procedure is. Then I would announce that I was going down. Why? At our airport, there's either very few people out on the ramp, or they're in hangars or doing something other than watching the runway.

I'd announce where I was crashing and 'could someone please come drag me out of the wreckage?' It sure would suck to go deadstick into the trees just out of sight and have no one notice.

Had a guy come into the hangar one spring day as we were working on planes. The pilot comes in and says he needs a hand..."sure, whatcha got?" He then proceeds to point out the window to a perfectly framed Cessna 150 flipped over on it's back alongside the runway! Didn't even squish the spinner in the mud!

But best to stay with the old adage: aviate, navigate, communicate!

Russ,
Anyone with a headset and a boom mike that can't fly theairplane and call a mayday silmultaneously probably oughtn't be flying in the first place.
Isn't it kind of like chewing gum and walking?

My flight instructor told me that in almost all situations you are best to make your #1 goal in an emergency situation to arrive flying. This guy did not do this and suffered the consequences. Hitting the trees would have probably been a better option than a stall spin accident trying to turn around before hitting the trees. Bill K

The really sad thing is they likely could have walked away from this. Mansfield (1b9) property lies right up against the east side of I-495. Rwy 14-32 roughly parallels 495 and is probably 1000-1300 feet east of the highway. Looking northbound, I-495 makes a large sweeping right-hand hook around the airport. The common emergency landing option (departing in either direction) is to simply fly straight ahead and land on 495.

It looked to me like he could have (barely) cleared the trees. If the pilot had leveled the nose and kept his speed up (and raised his flaps), a small directional change with rudder would have lined him up with 495 and the only damage would have been to his ego.

As Jud presviously mentioned... have a plan, brief the plan, fly the plan.

To some, performance limitations are unproven myth until they stuff it in the trees.

Some of the published limitations do seem like myths, at least for some of our 170's. This pilot probably just didn't realize the risk in overweight, slow speed, turns (let me edit before getting jumped on) is the reason he called before trying to turn. I've seen planes take out a lot of tree top without crashing.

Gar, just found a note on desk to call you - been in Texarkana at grandma's funeral all week. Had a wonderful roundtrip in 170 flying different relatives with me. Gave joy rides, while down there, much to family's delight. Having a 170 is just a neat thing!