The International Cessna^® 170 Association

Don't take it for granted anymore that mogas is safe for your airplane unless you test it. AOPA is warning aircraft owners who normally use automotive fuel purchased off the airport to test the gas for ethanol even if the pump doesn't say there's alcohol in the fuel. The federal government mandate to increase the use of renewable fuels in gasoline blends has prompted some companies to add ethanol without notification and that can be dangerous for aircraft engines. (http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/a ... tml#197788)

Idaho airports are finding ethanol in the fuel even at airports.

Ethanol-blended fuel reduces an aircraft’s range and performance, but it also deteriorates seals in aircraft engines, harms fuel bladders and hoses, and attracts water, which promotes rust that can damage cylinders and pistons. It can even lead to problems in electric fuel pumps and cause inaccurate indications on fuel gauges, according to studies by the FAA.

The AOPA website provides more details: http://www.aopa.org/aircraft/articles/2 ... hanol.html

you're just trying to liven up things since it's been slow lately, aren't you George?

How about a class action lawsuit if they put it in and don't post it

All the mogas I've tested in California has contained 5% alcohol ever since they stopped using MTBEsome years ago. That dumb ass C-170B of mine is too stupid to realize it is going to die from it and just keeps on drinking it. It's also too dumb to restrict its range and performance. A good many of my friends in various other types of airplanes are suffering from the same non problem. We're all gonna die!

Of all the 'Experts" that expound on this subject, I've never found even ONE that has had any PERSONAL experience with the supposed problem.

All the fuel I tested in PA when they stopped using MTBE and went to ethenal messured 10% ethenal. Though I tried not to use it like a good boy I'm sure some of it saw the inside of my tanks. The only thing I noticed was my fuel sumps seemed to rust and freeze.

So for more than a year now I've not even thought of running MOGAS because it is just not available without ethenal. I've been running pure 100LL and guess what. My brand new fuel sumps rusted up. And no while they were open I saw no more water coming out when they were drained with MOGAS or 100LL.

When this comes up I wonder what those airplanes that are STC'd to use E-85 do to eliminate all the hazards associated with ethenal. And I think that at some point in the future of GA aviation it will be commonplace to fly with ethenanl, if we are flying GA at all.

It seems that it was a some time ago that I explained the testing for alcohol process where a small amount of water is put in the tester glass then filled with the fuel to be tested. The total is vigorously shaken up and allowed to settle out. The water combines with the alcohol and the resultant increase in the water level in the tester shows the percent of alcohol present in the fuel sample.
As a method of rendering the alcohol "contaminated" mogas suitable for use in my airplane, I very facetiously, I thought, explained my method as "Pouring a quart or so of water into my fuel tanks, adding the mogas, vigorously shaking the airplane, allowing the mix to settle out , and then draining the sumps."
As ridiculous as this method sounds, you'd be amazed at the number of inquiries I got asking about its effectiveness. It kind of scared the hell out of me thinking someone would actually be dumb enough to try it. Apparently all the people with a pilot certificate are not necessarily the swiftest arrows in the flying quiver!

I don't remember exactly why I once thought to do this (I think it had something to do with cleaning out a fuel tank) but many, many years ago (back when I was a kid and auto gasoline was actually real gasoline) I added a cup of 100% methanol to the lawn mower gas tank. I let it sit overnight and tried to mow the lawn and of course it wouldn't start. I ended up turning the mower upside-down and draining it all out on the street. (Remember, this was back before anyone considered such acts treason-ous.) The gasoline sizzled down into the pavement and left big blobs of water sitting on top of the asphalt. I was amazed at how much water had been attracted by the alcohol just overnight.
Fresh gas and all was well, but perhaps the experience is another reason why I'm so adamant about not having any of that stuff in my airplane.

Other reasons not to use mogas besides the bad smell is that the more 100LL avgas we use, the bigger the market share, the more reason for the refiners to keep producing it, and possibly help keep the price down. Like George has said before, avgas used to be twice as expensive as mogas. Now its only 30% more.

I used thousands of gallons of mogas in the old regular leaded fuel days and never had one complaint other than smell, it worked fine in my 170 with the O-300-D and in the C-180 with an O-470-K. I will not use it anymore unless avgas goes away.

George will love this one, I spoke to (an un-named) fuel cell rep at the Alaska Aviation Trade Show this weekend. I was asking him how alcohol affected their new fuel bladders. He said they were making bladders without internal seams now by vulcanizing the interior of the tanks so alcohol did not affect them. They are using the same material for race car fuel cells and none of the exotic fuels will affect the bladder material. He also told me to help keep fuel bladders, hoses and internal carb parts working longer, use MMO. He said it was basically a less concentrated version of AvBlend. I did not ask him about it, he volunteered the info. He said fuel bladders that have had MMO used regularly last longer than those without it. It's anectdotal info but since I agree with it, I'll assume its accurate.

Now Richard, you guys are going to get George started again. Mentioning MoGas & MMO in the same post

Well Frank getting George excited is part of the fun participating on this forum.

Many a day I'm sitting around work waiting for a call having already found the end of the internet for the day. What to do, what to do. I know lets see if we can work MOGAS and MMO into a current thread and see what happens. There is bonus points if we can get Gahorn AND Blueldr all riled up.

N9149A wrote:Well Frank getting George excited is part of the fun participating on this forum.

Many a day I'm sitting around work waiting for a call having already found the end of the internet for the day. What to do, what to do. I know lets see if we can work MOGAS and MMO into a current thread and see what happens. There is bonus points if we can get Gahorn AND Blueldr all riled up.

WAL BRUCYBOY - U GOTS ME RILEUP ALREDY FININ THE N OF THE INERNET. AH DOANT LAK THAT WON LILBIT. ME AN GORE DUN STRECH ITS WAY OUT TO WHAR WE DOANT THINK EENYBODI FINE IT. NOW U DONE NOK THE FAT IN THU FAR. URE ONA POO LIS FER SURE! AN I HOPES SUMBODIE PUT SUM MMO IN YER KOFE!

I don't like that taste in good coffee. I use it for good things, like soakings.

I use it to marinate my ribs and brisket before I Bar-B-Q them. I also like to add a splash to a nice bed of mixed greens for that hint of wintergreen. Yum!