Rudder Control Cables

[tstar355]

Does anyone have data on how long both the R/H & L/H rudder cables are for the 1953 C170B starting from the center of the ball to the end of the stud? Where can I get the cables at a fair price. McFarlane seams kind of high "$108.00 each, Aircraft Spruce is a little better. Spruce can custom make if you know the proper length.
Thanks in advance.

[ronjenx]

I was thinking the McFarlane price is pretty fair. The factory price seems to be in the $399 range.

I have used McFarlane cables in a 170A, and they were exactly the correct length.

How much to have Aircraft Spruce make them?
And can you use them in your 170?

[GAHorn]

If you intend to have a non-PMA mfr'r make cables for you, you should provide them with the cables to be replaced and instruct them to "reverse engineer" the cables in an "owner-produced part" scenario.

Get some strong, nylon cord, and as you pull the cables out use them to pull the cord into place. Send the cables to whomever makes them for you, and then use the cord to pull the new cables back into the airplane.

I also would lean toward McFarlane for my cables. They specialize in them. (Univair is one of our supporters and also makes this cable PN 0510105-1 presently for $133.) http://univairparts.com/shopping/produc ... s_id=29990

[tstar355]

ronjenx,
Thanks for your reply. If someone knows the exact length in inches of each cable from the center of the ball to the end of the stud I could get the exact price for a custom set from spruce. I used an estimated length to come up with a rough cost at spruce $52.52 each. That’s about ½ the McFarlane price of $108.00 each.
Thanks in advance.

gahorn,
Are you saying that Spruce is a non-PMA mfr'r of cables? If so I don't want them.
Thanks

[GAHorn]

...
gahorn,
Are you saying that Spruce is a non-PMA mfr'r of cables? If so I don't want them.
Thanks

You should ask Spruce if their cables are PMA'd. (If they were, then they'd have no need for you to tell them the length...they'd already know the exact specifications of those cables. Parts Manufacturing Authority is only issued to mfr's who demonstrate the ability and integrity to duplicate the essential form, fit, function of the original parts.)

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

Went to straighten up what I thought was a small mess on my A model. We know that the cable lengths are the same and that the eye bolts are different lengths to make up for the rudder pedal bars being mounted one in front of the other.

So there I was with a new AN165L and a short barrel to replace the long barrel and AN165S that have been used on the left side and then also be able to use the stock length link where someone had drilled a custom new hole.

That is when I discovered something I hadn't noticed before. My control cables have tow different ends, one short the other long. thus making one cable longer than the other and the worst part is the long cable is on the right side which is the short side.
Oh did I mention I discovered I also ordered a AN165LL (that's with left hand threads)

right.jpg

Right side is longer

left.jpg

Left side is shorter

So I need to know can you remove these rudder cables by just pulling then forward through the pulleys and fairlead with a string attached to pull the new cables back into place or do I need to remove the interior in order to crawl into the tail boom?

I may try swapping cables side to side then using an AN165S on both sides, which I have on hand, before ordering new cables and another AN165L. Either way I'll be removing the cables.

Also I should have looked closer at the links (#31 fig 65 0310219-2 B model IPC). Can anyone tell me what they are made off?

[GAHorn]

The links are plain steel (probably 4130). I've never actually pulled cables with string, but my neighbor claims to have done it to his A-model using hay baleing wire. (He's a farmer/rancher.)

[KS170A]

So I need to know can you remove these rudder cables by just pulling then forward through the pulleys and fairlead with a string attached to pull the new cables back into place or do I need to remove the interior in order to crawl into the tail boom?

Although my overall project includes much more than control cables and had already required the complete removal of my interior, you will need to crawl back into the tailcone to free up the cables through the pulleys.

I removed both rudder cables and both elevator cables a few weekends ago. 3 of the 4 require replacement! I haven't pulled the aileron, flap and elevator trim cables yet, but have assumed they must all require replacement. I have not located any logbook entries indicating replacement, so I figure it's time. I ordered a complete kit from McFarlane today. The damage to the elevator control cable (photo attached) was located (the best I can estimate) under the floorboards, in the vicinity of the fuel selector. There is a pulley in that vicinity that is a real pain to deal with.

[c170b53]

Bruce when you asked this question it dawned on me how fortunate you folks are to have two holidays and with feasts in two consecutive months. Then I realized that I couldn't answer your question without spoiling that upcoming turkey dinner. Good luck and hunting back there.

[KS170A]

Also I should have looked closer at the links (#31 fig 65 0310219-2 B model IPC). Can anyone tell me what they are made off?

.063" 4130

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

Thanks Josh for the thickness.

Did I happen to mention that someone at some point drilled new holes in one set of links in order to shorten the link. But that short link was not on the long cable side.

But wait before I realized I had a long and short cable and before I realized I also had the wrong length barrel and eye on one side I was trying to adjust the peddles to the 6" from the fire wall spec. This would have been about 7 months ago. I remember now moving that short link to the other side in order to make something workable for each side. At the time I couldn't understand why some drilled those new holes in the link. So before I messed with anything the short link was on the long cable side. This was obviously someones fix for the long cable.

Anyway I might not soon have the pleasure of replacing the long cable if the short link works with it and the correct short barrel with the correct AN165L eye works on the other side.

[wingnut]

Bruce,
Be aware the A model parts illustration is wrong; it shows the long eye on the right. The long one should be on the left as shown in the B model illustration. In both the A and B parts, they show the barrels being the same left and right, but the A model illustration shows the left eye item numbers reversed.
I've seen all manner of parts changes in this area to compensate for prior improper installations, which may well be due to the IPC errors.
If you do replace the cables, I've it easier in most areas to remove the pulleys instead of the cotter pins, especially the forward pulleys. This also gives you an opportunity to better inspect the pulley groove and bearing/bushing.

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

Thanks for the warning about he A model IPC Del. I'd seen your warning before and in actual use the A model IPC actually also identifies the wrong part for the id number in the figure. I have IPCs for the A and B model and have become use to looking at BOTH of them when I'm looking at parts. Probably because on my last 170 I thought I might find parts from either model and I was always looking to see what should be there verses what was there.

Because of the nature of my first aircraft I've made a pretty in depth study of all models in certain areas, many that most folks don't look to hard at. Since I'd recently realized my hardware in this area wasn't per the IPC I'd made a study of that area at the last convention on most of the aircraft on the field. There were some interesting things to see and I will just say if I end up with two different length links to compensate for a long cable, I won't be the only one.

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

So the plot thickens. Seems my partner, the person who 10 years ago replaced the left rudder cable (the one that seems to be the right length) because he thought he should, still has the cable he replaced and it has the same end (long) as our right cable. That is the right cable he thought he could leave in the plane for a few more years. Why he thought one should be replaced and not the other is a mystery. He kept the removed cable all these years just in case. Like he would actually reinstall a cable he though he should remove it he ever needed another. He's got a great mechanical mind but sometimes you have to wonder.

Anyway assuming the removed cable is the same as the one still remaining that appears to be long, we measured it. And since it was never answered I'm hoping someone that has their cables removed can also measure theirs. This one, which I think will be long (like the one still installed) measured 225 3/8 inches from the tip of the threads on the turn buckle end to the center of the attaching hole at the other end.

BTW my partner thought since the one cable he didn't change out seems to be long anyway, that it might be time to change it out. Even at the cost of $108.

[N2255D]

Bruce I'm with you, If your going to go through the trouble of changing one side do them both and replace the hardware. I found some broken strands on one of my rudder cables during an annual. It was where the cable went over the pulley as it goes through the aft bulkhead. There were only 2 strands broken but I ordered a left and right cable and all the hardware. When I got the cables out I found that the other side, in the area inside of the tail-cone, was really the bad one. The hardware attaching the cables to the rudder pedals was shot too, but the easy to get to stuff was in good shape.