Walla Walla to Dixie

[pilotlaw]

Greetings folks:

Though I have visited the Forum many times since joining the Association last year, this is my first post. I am presently a non-owner member, but some of you may be familiar with me from conversations we may have had concerning finding a 170 to change that status to owner/member. Hopefully, by the end of next week, a conditional contract on a 170B will have found fruition, and I will be faced with the task of flying it to North Georgia from its base at Walla Walla, Washington.

Here's where I need some advice. Most...well, actually, all, of the flying I have done over the last 25 years has been filing IFR and at altitudes above 30,000 feet. I have been out west quite a bit, but not up-close and personal with the terrain.

Is there anyone out there reading this post who has made a trip in a light airplane from SE Washington into the Plains States, and if so, what have you found to be the best route(s). This airplane lacks a GPS, although I may have one aboard courtesy of a friend. Nevertheless, I hope to use "old fashioned VFR" cross country planning and navigating to reinforce those long dormant skills, backing them up with the GPS.

But I do need an idea of where and how experienced folks have gone through the Rockies (or in avoiding them altogether, the least cost/time route around). Your responses are most humbly appreciated.

Bruce Hain
Kennesaw, Georgia

[3958v]

While not an experienced mountain pilot I have flown my 170 in the Rockies a few times including a trip last week over Rocky Mountain National Park. Some of the advice I received which turned out to be real good. 1) Fly the mountains in the morning. 2) Keep the airplane light. 3) Dont fly in visabilities below 15 or 20 miles. 4) Dont fly if the winds aloft ar higher than 25 knots. 6) In the begining select long runways which will let you land on the remaining runway if you can not get out of ground effect. My 170 loaded light had no problem getting to 13,000 feet. I have crossed along the southern border of Glacier Park with no problem. I have also crossed over Yellowstone with no problem. You did not mention how much tail wheel experience you had but if you dont have much that might concern me more than the mountains. Have a safe trip. I have found mountain flying some of the most enjoyable flying I have ever done but saffety must be number one. Bill K.

[blueldr]

Let the weather be your guide!

[GAHorn]

Hello, Bruce!
I helped a buddy bring his brand "B" airplane (normally aspirated Debonaire) from Seattle to Houston. We studied the IFR low altitude enroute charts and looked at the MEA's and MOCA's to pick a route which led us to Boise for fuel, then to SLC for an overnight. (A fairly low route out of SLC can be had to the south towards LAS then turn east, also,) Be very careful of any clouds in the Cascades southeast of Boise tho', they can ice you up even in warm weather.
Next we went to Montrose, CO to visit a friend and then ( or you can go thru the mountains due east of Montrose , which VFR can be done with plenty of spare altitude at 12,500' then south toward Santa Fe for more fuel) we went south out of Montrose toward ABQ and then over to ROW for more fuel. Rest of the way was easy.
Anyway, look at the IFR low altitude charts to pick a good route and also carry fresh/current Sectionals and you'll do fine. Yep, get early starts to avoid thermals.

[N73087]

I made the trip from Seattle to FL last year, Roughly Spokane, Sand Point, then the Clark Fork River to Great Falls. After that, it is all flatland. My recollection is that the highest point on that route is the pass just southwest of Great Falls, and it is only about 5800 feet. You will be in the mountains only about two hours.

[cessna170bdriver]

Bruce,

Congratulations on finding a 170!

When I flew to the Cessna 170 convention in Kalispell, MT in 1995 from southern Mississippi, on the return trip we crossed the Contintntal Divide via the pass just east of Bozeman, MT, on I-90 then refuled at Laurel, MT, near Billngs. From Laurel we headed toward Syndey, NE (Cabella's will pick you up at the airport for eating/shopping). From Sydney it's a straight shot into the southeastern US.

As for getting from southeastern Washington state into western Montana, check your charts, but the best I remember, the terrain is rugged, but not much over 8000' if that high. Good weather will be the order of the day.

Hoe this helps, and let us know how the trip goes,
Miles

[bentley]

Bruce:
I fly across the Rockies on a routine basis for work all in Cessna singles. The route you describe is doable with options and keeping in mind the standard warnings about VFR in montainous terrain IE morning flight, light winds, light loads etc. In all but severe clear weather I fly Mullen Pass which is generally Lewiston ID(LWS) - Missoula(MSO)-Great Falls(GTF). From MSO you can bend south and head near Helena(HLN) instead depending on weather. The route can be flown safely well within the operational envelope of a C170 especially since you will be going the "right" way that is with the wind and you can get some impressive ground speeds between MSO and GTF. You do NOT need a GPS and in fact the scenery is such that you should be looking outside anyway. If the skies are real clear you can do some sort of direct routing LWS-GTF that still keeps the rocks below the wings BUT at times you will be far from landable/searchable terrain so risk is higher. Either way it's no biggy provided you respect that this is not flatland and plan accordingly. CBs tend to build in the afternoons along the route and don't not always clear by morning. From July-Sept check fire TFRs as they spring up all the time.

RB

[pilotlaw]

I want to begin by thanking those Members that responded to my post in late July about bringing my Washington-based '54 "B" model home to Georgia, and the best route to take through the mountains. Your advice was collectively printed out and referred to during the trip.

Briefly, here is how it went:

Took my Dad along, as he has lots of tailwheel time and had never gone through the Rockies at low altitude (as I never had either). It was as much a treat for him as it was for me.

From Pasco (KPSC), we left later than we wanted to, so did not get too far on the first day. Flew over the Seven Devils in Idaho, gas/lunch stop at McCall (KMYL). Quit at Pocatello (KPIH) mid-afternoon after spying many build-ups over hills to the east.

Day 2 was a killer - KPIH southeast to Bear Lake (Utah/Wyoming border), then east past Rock Springs. Into Colorado over Steamboat Springs then alternated going south, north and east through Willow Creek Pass, then over Lake Granby, then attempted to cut through Milner Pass, but thought the altitude cushion was not enough there, so we headed slightly further north to where the MORA was in the 10's (vs. the 13.5+) and turned east and into Greeley-Weld, CO, where we stopped for fuel/lunch. In the air again and on our way over flat terrain to stop for the night in Manhattan, Kansas (KMHK) after 9 hours.

Day 3 went from KMHK to southeastern Missouri (KTKX-Kennett Memorial) for lunch/fuel, then on to home at KVPC (Cartersville, GA).

Advice given was right on the mark:

1) start early - when we had NOT followed this rule on Day One, we got the #*$@ knocked out of us.

2) stay light - can easily see how this helps, especially in the high altitude performance

3) good weather - no decision had to be made here, did not get bad weather (nearly IFR haze) until in the SE USA. Western flying beats all!

4) formualte a navigation plan - carefully reviewed route each night and executed the plan

5) look outside, forget the GPS - using Sectionals (and the occasional WAC) got us through the mountains. We did have an expensive borrowed GPS, which worked well, but it's usefulness was in the direct routings AFTER the Rockies crossing. Could not get the terrain feature to work for us at all. The charts, pilotage and combined experience of me and Dad made the trip fun navigationally-speaking.

Thanks again for your help, TIC170A - hope to be associated for a long time.

Bruce Hain
N4234N '54 "B"

[cessna170bdriver]

Congratulation Bruce!

Sounds like you had quite the adventure. Get used to the haze, etc. in the South, especially in the summer. 5 miles viz is a good day, 10 miles is CAVU. I've definitely been spoiled in my 9 years out west. There are guys here that get antsy in 15 miles viz or less

Have you met any of the other 170ers in your area? Two come to mind: Harold Holliman up in LaFayette, and Scott Barland in Marietta. I'm sure there are others, but those two come immediately to mind. With any luck I may be back that way myself in a few months. I'm working on a possible transfer back to Tullahoma, TN.

Miles

[pilotlaw]

Hey Miles:

Thanks for the congrats! It was a great trip, no doubt, and one that I was glad to have my Dad along for. He really enjoyed himself. He lost his medical to diabetes in 1985 and has hardly flown since, after a military and airline career and rebuilding a Cub and a 170A in the 60s. Although the days were long, he was more than up to the task and had a smile on his face the whole time. But he was sawing wood in a serious way in the hotel room each night while I called FSS to file the next day's flight plan. Great memories.

I have met and spoken with Scott Barland and Bruce Kown (his hangar-mate) many times (more like "I have bugged them many times with questions" - both very gracious guys) and had the pleasure of communicating with most Georgia 170 owners when I wrote them all asking about leads on airplanes for sale nearby. I hope to get to know more of them, as they were extremely helpful throughout my dragged-out search for a 170. I have written to Harold about his radios.

Have not had the pleasure of pleasure flying in the West until this trip home, and the experience weather-wise was great. I was raised eastern seaboard and lived with haze throughout my flying career. In the southeast it is worse, you are right about that. Wished I had a reason, or excuse, to take that thing back out West again. Maybe sometime.

Hope to see you and your machine when you come 'back East'.

Bruce Hain
#26263

[GAHorn]

I've got a GREAT excuse for you, Bruce! Next year! In Kelowna! Be there!