Advice on possible C170B purchase

cherring · Post by **cherring** » Mon May 07, 2012 6:08 pm

Hi all,

I am new to the board. I am looking for some advice about whether to buy a C170B "project" or walk away. The plane was last flown in 1996. The owner hit a pool of water on the soft, grass airstrip and flipped the plane forward onto its back. There are bends/dents on the top of the vertical stab and rudder. The prop was at idle. It was taken off and straightened/repaired, then the plane was flown again around the pattern before being parked outside at the grass strip.

The owner said that some rivets would need to be replaced on the right wing, but there does not appear to be any major damaged to the wings. There is quite a bit of dirt & plant growth (lichens etc) one would expect from sitting outside under a tree for so long. A new paint job, obviously. Needs a new windshield and new interior. I was told that corrosion would not be a problem. Surface rust on fasteners, etc. I shooed a family of birds out of the cowling where they had made their home.

The C145 engine had about 640 hours SMOH on it. The owner said "squirt some lubricant into the cylinders before turning it over" but did not seem to think a tear-down was necessary. I'm sure I'll get some responses about that.

It does have a fairly nice IFR panel with mostly new, some old radios. This is one of the things that appealed to me. A couple of the antennas were broken off when it flipped, but really no dents or damage on top, other than the tail.

As I said, trying to decide whether it's feasible to restore, or if I should walk away. The price is low enough to take a look. Any and all comments and suggestions would be welcome.

Thanks in advance,

Cliff

minton · Post by **minton** » Mon May 07, 2012 6:56 pm

Cliff,

If you are a novice to aircraft I would advise you get a local A&P with C-170 knowledge to help you through this. Trying to use the internet for this purpose will never work.

John

Post by **Bruce Fenstermacher** » Mon May 07, 2012 7:50 pm

First if the prop needed to be removed to be repaired, Continental and Lycoming consider this enough for a mandatory engine teardown inspection. Most others will also consider this mandatory and until done the engine will have little value. So the owner thinks the plane can sit for 16 years and just squirt a little lubricant in the cylinders and it will be OK.
Why won't corrosion be a problem? Corrosion can be a problem for hanger kept airplanes without birds living in the cowl. It is a rare airplane that can flip on it's back, and then be flipped back up right with damage only to the rudder and a few rivets.

Do you want to restore a plane or find a cheap airplane? This will likely not be a cheap airplane. Nothing having to do with the words restore and airplane are cheap. If the owner paid you what he's trying to sell the plane for your likely to have more into the plane than it is worth by the time your done so I doubt the price could be right.

FredMa · Post by **FredMa** » Mon May 07, 2012 8:19 pm

Cliff, you did not mention where this plane is located. There are probably individuals on here that are close by. You do need someone experienced to look at the plane for you. It is recommended for an engine with prop strike to have a complete tear down since the prop sustained damage requiring prop removal for repair. It has also been sitting for some 16 years, reason two that it needs a complete tear down. This should be factored into the price. The damage you describe doesn't sound too bad but there can also be hidden damage you can't see. I you are inclined to make a serious offer on this plane you need a detailed inspection to get a true sense of its worth. I would recommend a complete "annual" type inspection with particular attention to hidden corrosion and damage from the roll over it encountered.

cherring · Post by **cherring** » Mon May 07, 2012 10:20 pm

Thanks for the replies so far... please keep them coming. Fully what I expected to hear, and good to have a reality check to keep from making any kind of hasty decision. I will probably try to get an A & P friend to take a look at it, then if he thinks it has potential, pay an A & P who's familiar with the plane to give me a second opinion. I realize it's probably going to cost a fair amount to even find out if it's worth anything.

Thanks again... all advice appreciated.

Cliff

minton · Post by **minton** » Mon May 07, 2012 10:24 pm

cherring wrote:Thanks for the replies so far... please keep them coming. Fully what I expected to hear, and good to have a reality check to keep from making any kind of hasty decision. I will probably try to get an A & P friend to take a look at it, then if he thinks it has potential, pay an A & P who's familiar with the plane to give me a second opinion. I realize it's probably going to cost a fair amount to even find out if it's worth anything.

Thanks again... all advice appreciated.

Cliff

The little money spent looking the plane over is money saved in the end!

ghostflyer · Post by **ghostflyer** » Mon May 07, 2012 10:43 pm

I am very interested why the original owner didn't fix it 16 years ago if it is in so good condition. as every body has stated get at least 2 opinions on getting it airworthy bbe very carefull of aircraft that birds have made their home.Ccorrosion is Always found in these situations especially after 16years.

FredMa · Post by **FredMa** » Mon May 07, 2012 11:37 pm

It is also very intresting that the owner claims that he flew it again in a known unairworthy condition after having the prop repaired. I would be willing to bet that the prop repair was not done correctly and properly documented.

Post by **GAHorn** » Mon May 07, 2012 11:50 pm

If you wish to have the pleasure of restoring a wrecked, dilapidated aircraft,.....if you can buy
it cheap....you'll get your hearts desire.
If you wish to get into a 170 that's flyable and economical.... this is NOT likely it.

The most economical airplane you can own is the one in the very BEST condition
you can afford to buy.

cherring · Post by **cherring** » Tue May 08, 2012 12:27 am

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
If you wish to have the pleasure of restoring a wrecked, dilapidated aircraft,.....if you can buy
it cheap....you'll get your hearts desire.
If you wish to get into a 170 that's flyable and economical.... this is NOT likely it.

The most economical airplane you can own is the one in the very BEST condition
you can afford to buy.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

So true. If you want to work on airplanes, buy a project. If you want to fly, buy one that's flying now.

I believe the owner probably did fly it once around the patch after it flipped, but probably wasn't enough to get any idea of real damage. I think he must have just gotten out of flying around that time. The sad part is that there is also a C180 which hasn't been flown for years parked outside beside the 170B. It looks to be in the same condition, minus the dents. Hate to see such nice old birds being left to deteriorate like that.

Cliff

minton · Post by **minton** » Tue May 08, 2012 1:40 am

Cliff,

Think of "A PROJECT" as an ICE BERG, you see some but by no means all of the problems. They all look do-able then you dig into them and find all manner of $$$$$$$ problems $$$$$$$$ and many, many, many man hours. Most salvage outfits buy them as part outs or pass them along as a project for someone else to discover their true value

John

bigrenna · Post by **bigrenna** » Tue May 08, 2012 2:11 am

delete

blueldr · Post by **blueldr** » Tue May 08, 2012 4:27 am

The first thing to do is to put on your absolutely best running shoes, then SHAG YOUR ASS AWAY FROM THIS AERONAUTICAL DISASTER! There is no way this could possibly be cheap enough.
Right now it is a super buyers market for airplanes of all kinds.
There's got to be a damn good reason this wreck has been sitting unclaimed for sixteen years.

DaveF · Post by **DaveF** » Tue May 08, 2012 11:23 pm

Guys, I think we've been had. All this story lacks is immersion in salt water.

Cliff, are you real?

FredMa · Post by **FredMa** » Wed May 09, 2012 3:05 am

Well, the owner did claim he hit a pool of water and flipped over.

The International Cessna^® 170 Association